TikTok are mad for Mochi. Meet Howard Wong, Co-Founder of Little Moons

Viv had the pleasure of speaking with Howard Wong, Co-Founder of Little Moons Mochi. The mochi icecream brand has recently been catching fame thanks to TikTok, with 700% uplift in Tesco sales of Little Moons mochi and 106M views (and counting) on TikTok. 

To listen to the full interview, listen to Viv Yau’s podcast ‘But Where are You From’ for more from Howard Wong on identity, his business and why all British Asians need to buy a dog to experience unconditional love. 

How do you relate to your identity in terms of your Malaysian Chinese identity versus being British?  Do you find that your relationship with your identity changes at all? 

Definitely. Looking back, I've gone through various sort of evolutions of my identity. When I was a kid in primary school, I remember almost wanting to reject my Chinese heritage and trying to be just like every other kid. I remember I had an uncle - he was quite patriotic - and he talked about things and I'd just argue with him telling him how great the UK was.

I went to an all boys school in North London, which was really ethnically diverse, so I became really aware of  racial identities and how different groups are to hang out with. Then I became quite proud of my Chinese identity and it has become a big part of who I am. I've got a lot of friends who are ethnically Chinese or British-born Asian.

Even if I moved to Asia,  people might not see me as Chinese, but I'm pretty comfortable with my identity as a British-born Chinese person.

Have you visited Malaysia much? Is there part of you that thinks Malaysia feels like home at all?

I don't go back to Malaysia very often, and if I'm being honest, I don't feel that Malaysian. I don't have that much culturally in common with Malaysian Chinese people - my identity is more ethnically Chinese. I get on well with international people in general, and people who come from immigrant families, whether they be Indian, Pakistani etc. We have shared cultural experiences, shared cultural things. 

How have you felt recently with the uprising  COVID racism? Has it affected you at all personally?

I've noticed it around. I'm obviously following groups that highlight when people have been subjected to racism, and I totally can imagine it being an increasing problem. Personally, I've been quite lucky to not have really directly experienced it. I live in a pretty safe part of London, and I just hang out with people I know. But, historically, I have experienced racist comments, for example on the bus and pub. I know what kids are like, you're walking past and they'll say something but I've been lucky enough not to experience it. But I can imagine it happening since there's so much anti-China rhetoric in the media and politics, and it's not necessarily an obvious bias but to me, it's definitely there.

Tell us about your business, Little Moons Mochi and how it started?

Well, my parents ran a bakery, an Asian bakery actually, in London and mochi was actually one of the hero products. Myself and my sister, we've always loved their products. But when my mum was encouraging us to bring some mochi to friends I would say ‘I don't think they're going to like it, especially the products filled with red bean paste, is a little bit too ‘alien’ for the western palate at the moment’.

I did economics at university and I went into finance - as a ‘good Asian’ kid did. So I was a banker when I was younger but I very soon realized that it wasn't that fun. I felt there was a lot more creativity in what I am doing now. I'm also a jack of all trades, but a master of none - so I thought being an entrepreneur suited that because it’s a bit of sales, a bit of marketing, a bit of finance, and we just really believed in this opportunity. I think we were quite naïve at that point, just thinking that we could just start a business. That was 10 years ago now.

And actually, mochi ice cream is really difficult to build [within the dessert] category. Most people launch a gourmet ‘something’ or vegan ‘something’ - something that sounds really familiar but just a ‘pimped out’ version of it, whereas mochi ice cream is just different. I would go to a feature in a Birmingham food show and you'd have people that normally run small B&B’s asking ‘What is this?’ It was a long, hard slog at the beginning. Though, we have had some lucky breaks - one of our early customers was Yo Sushi, which helped with volume, and then we also supply to a Japanese restaurant in London called Nobu.

The last few weeks [with the recent Little Moons viral TikTok trend] have just been absolutely mental. It's surreal to see people eating our products around the country. And not just the Asian community. 

I looked on TikTok before and  it was reported that  you've had 700% uplift in sales. And it was reported to be at 19.5 million views. It's gone up to 106.8 million views on TikTok. You mentioned it was an organic viral thing but actually everything that you both have done until this point has led to this success.

We've been building this for the last 10 years, getting into restaurants is where people discover new foods, and we've opened pop up shops in places like Selfridges, Westfield - just getting people introduced to the product. The last few months, with everyone in lockdown, there's very little to get excited about - all you can do is go to the supermarket. It's our lucky break and a chance to get everyone excited about this product that's really ‘unusual’.

I do feel it's a bit of a responsibility to raise my profile as someone who's British Born Chinese. I think there are people that don't know that Little Moons is founded by people with Asian heritage who have been making mochi for years. So I think some people think Little Moons is a really whitewashed knockoff mochi and that we're trying to rebrand mochi into Little Moons.

You mentioned how you got your first lucky break with Yo Sushi. How did that come about then?

So we went to a restaurant show for trade buyers, the head chef at Yo Sushi met us there and really liked the product. They then placed a huge order from us [at the time]. We sell stuff by pallets, which are those wooden crates, and at the time, our factory was too small to have one of those fit through the door. For us it was an amazingly big order. We had to build up the pallets outside and then borrow a forklift truck from our neighbours. 

Did you at that point take stock to celebrate that you’re working with Yo Sushi ?

We thought it was amazing. Viv [Howard’s sister and co-founder of Little Moons] and I are both guilty of not really stopping to celebrate success that much. We’re always right onto the next thing or actually focusing on the fact that this is also really stressful because we've got this scale of whole new challenges. So generally we’re always quite forward looking but lately, we've been much more into celebrating. 

How did your parents encourage you at the beginning of the business? 

Viv and I were obsessed with branding and I think we were spending quite a lot of money, just faffing around thinking about what to call ourselves. There came a point when my mum - who’s a fairly shrewd businessperson came in and said ‘Okay, I think it's time now that you stopped sort of spending money on branding and and really focused on sales...where's the money?’ 

Looking back, did you think that was good advice?

Actually, yes. So my mum is a huge role model for me, and so even when she's criticising you - you don't really hear it. But deep down you think, ‘you might have a point’.

One thing I've learned over the years is that you can't just keep trying to perfect something before you launch into the world - you have just put it out and get on with it. It reminds of the 80/20 rule, which I definitely believe in, which is basically a theory that you can get 80% of the way there with 20% of the effort, and the final 20% of perfecting something takes a lot of time and energy.

How is it working with your sister, Vivien Wong?

“[My relationship with my sister] has evolved as well over time. We were really close, growing up and then we started working together. We lived together at the same time, which, as you can imagine, was pretty stressful. Plus, our team was really small, so it was down to us to do things that fell down the cracks -the bits that neither of us wanted to do - and we blamed each other for not doing it because we thought the other person had done it. That was difficult.“

Then as the business grew, we took these personality tests. And the tests made us realise that we're basically complete opposites to each other in the way we think. It helped identify what our strengths and weaknesses are and that's really helped us understand where we're coming from. We've realised that so many decisions we've made in the past are down to us having different views, and finally now we’re getting to some sort of compromise. Now, we split the roles up separately and we have a bigger team. It's working really well, I'm really glad to be able to go on this journey with her. 

So what would you say your strengths are versus hers? And how do you complement each other in that way?

I'm quite analytical. And I think about things quite a lot. I am quite strategic. Viv uses her instinct a lot, which is often the right call for things. And she's quicker to make decisions. And she's also really good at thinking about what the team needs and creating a nice culture in the company.

Do you talk about work when it comes to family gatherings? 

Because our parents always used to do that, we tried to avoid doing that as much as we can. But obviously, things still come up. And when there's actually amazing stuff happening,  for example this TikTok trend, we’ll talk about it with family. Though usually we try to avoid it if we can.

When did you find out that Little Moons was blowing up on TikTok? When was it first on your radar? 

It was about two weeks ago [28th Jan 2021], we had a Monday meeting and our Marketing Executive said ‘we've been getting tagged in quite a lot of TikTok videos’. Then throughout the day of scrolling on TikTok we saw more and more videos. When it hit 15 million views, we thought ‘This is incredible. This is the best thing that's ever happened to us’. We were trying to get to the retailers to tell them to stock up. And since then, it hasn't actually died down. I think some people are getting a bit sick of seeing us on TikTok - it’s just videos of people going to Tesco and looking for Little Moons. It's been really exciting.

What are the next plans from this?

This is an amazing gift for us. The challenge we've always had is getting people to know what mochi ice cream is, figure out the pricing and for people to know that it's in the freezer aisle. And TikTok has been a way for people to describe how it tastes. People see it, they see the colors. So now, we're just going to try and get into more and more supermarkets. But I think one of the problems everyone has is they can't really find us because whilst we’re in Tesco, we're not in all of them. We're also in Waitrose and Ocado but that's still not a huge part of the population. So the next plan is that we're going to focus on trying to get into those [stores] and then at the same time trying to scale up production to meet that demand.

What’s been the best moment of your career so far?

Honestly, the last two weeks [with the TikTok viral trend]. It's been a long journey and we've had loads of stressful times. And I guess some of the things we've been most excited about are getting into Whole Foods  - because that was the first time we were available in a supermarket. We've had loads of amazing moments but this TikTok trend I feel like it's a once in a lifetime thing. It doesn't really happen often. I can't think of any other food brands where this is happening. It's literally been mind blowing.

What has been the hardest or most challenging moment of your career so far?

I think when I was having all these issues with working with my sister. I think that was really challenging because it got to the point where we really had to work things out, because we were falling out over business, which is never a good thing. That was really tough. And I guess, Brexit has been a massive challenge for us as well. We export 50% of our stuff to Europe, and it's just been a complete minefield to navigate. We were making decisions on whether to move into a bigger factory or not and that was a decision that was really hard to make with all the uncertainty. I think we've been quite lucky actually - there's never been any like soul destroying bad moments.

So there's no melted mochi vans somewhere?

Yes actually! When we’re shipping stuff out to the UAE. And it’s been left on a hot runway with the paperwork slot. There’s been thousands of pounds down the drain.

What's one golden nugget you'd give to anyone wanting to start their own business?

I think at the early stages of a business, really interrogate your business plan and make sure it's something that people want before you drop everything. It's also really nice to have a co-founder. Because you experience lonely times. And being able to talk to someone, as a co-founder is really handy. So I'd really encourage that. I think our business took a kind of step change in growth when we started getting external help. I don't mean in funding - we've got a Non-Executive Director who'd done this all before with another brand with loads of experience. I'm not saying all of them are good - you have to pick one that you get on with, and you think can really add value. 

Do people think that your lifestyle as an entrepreneur is glamorous? Is that that perception?

I think in the early days people saw that it was a pretty long slog. For example, going in on a Saturday to help with deliveries or going in on a Sunday evening to work. So I think, early on when you don't have a team around you, it's not that glamorous. Now we’ve reached a stage where it's so much easier than it was before. 

What's your day to day responsibilities like? 

I take care of creating demand, and my sisters in charge of supply. I'm looking at sales and marketing and I have an amazing Head of Sales and Head of Marketing who are both way better at their jobs than I am. That's an amazing thing to be able to hire people who are great. The old cliché of ‘hiring better than you are smarter’. 

I think running a business, to me, is just constant problem solving. There's always challenges and things you need to figure out, which is part of the fun. And also, the nightmare of it when there's just things that you think ‘there are no solutions to this’.  Things are going to go wrong.

Final question, Howard. Rice or noodles. Which one would you pick if you had to pick one for the rest of your life?

 Well, my brother-in-law says ‘No rice. No life.’ 

But I love noodles. I can't get enough of them. And instant noodles are my guilty pleasure. So I'd have to pick noodles. 

Viv interjects with ‘TEAM NOODLES!’

I love rice. There is definitely a place for rice. But like noodles, like there's just so much choice. They're both really good. Instant noodles are also what I usually have for lunch most days. I think they're healthier versions coming out. But yeah, but I discovered they were deep fried. It was kind of a sad day for me. 

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